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Don't Go There

by: Dean Barker

Fri Aug 24, 2007 at 15:54:24 PM EDT


Hillary Clinton in Concord today yesterday:
"It's a horrible prospect to ask yourself 'What if? What if?' But if certain things happen between now and the election, particularly with respect to terrorism, that will automatically give the Republicans an advantage again, no matter how badly they have mishandled it, no matter how much more dangerous they have made the world. So I think I'm the best of the Democrats to deal with that as well."

Believe it or not, Senator Clinton, some of us up heaah in the sticks have actually heard of Manhattan.  In fact, long before you moved to New York to run for Senator, I grew up just outside of the city, with the view of the twin towers often in my skyline.  My brother worked in one of them right after the 1993 bombing, and I lived in NYC during the mid to late 90's.  Several communities that I called home were devastated by the terrorist attacks, and I knew people who were killed.

When Republicans use 9/11 for political gain, I feel like I am being kicked in the stomach.

I've got three words for Democrats who would emulate that despicable tactic: don't go there.

I find it especially galling to hear it coming from a Democratic Senator who voted for war in Iraq, a war having nothing to do with 9/11, but who, unlike just about all the other Democrats who voted thus, refuses to say that it was a mistake.

Chris Dodd isn't amused either: "Frankly, I find it tasteless to discuss political implications when talking about a potential terrorist attack on the United States."

[Evening Update:] A reader alerted me to this response to Dodd from Team Hillary:

Asked for a response to Dodd's charge, Clinton spokesman Isaac Baker tells First Read, "Sen Clinton was making clear that she has the strength and experience to keep the country safe."
I don't get it. It doesn't clarify the earlier statement, or even relate to it, imho. The fact, however, that there is a response is interesting. [End Update]

[Evening Update #2] More reaction from the candidates:

Edwards Camp: Hillary's Terror Remarks "Deeply Troubling"

John Edwards spokesman Chris Kofinis also blasted Hillary: "Senator Clinton?s remarks are deeply troubling. After nearly seven years of George Bush and the politics of fear, the American people deserve a President who will focus first on keeping America safe, rather than calculating the political consequences. Unfortunately, Senator Clinton is seemingly taking a page straight from the GOP playbook that got us into this mess ? using fear of another terror attack as a political tactic to bolster her candidacy, and that is just wrong."


Richardson: Hillary "Seems To Think" Bush Has Made Us Safer

Bill Richardson had a statement, as well. "We shouldn't be thinking about terrorism in terms of its domestic political consequences, we should be protecting the country from terrorists," said Richardson. "Senator Clinton seems to think that President Bush has made this country safer. I disagree with her. Our failed policy in Iraq is making us less safe."


Obama Camp: Hillary Obsessed With Republican Attack Machine

Barack Obama advisor David Axelrod said that Hillary Clinton has been obsessed "with what she calls the Republican attack machine." Instead, Axelrod said, "I think we need a candidate who is obsessed with unifying this country again."

[End Update]

Oh, and then there's the fact that Clinton's statement completely reinforces a bogus right wing frame that America is just now climbing out of.  By stating it as a Democrat she reinforces the validity of the lie that Republicans own the security issue.

Absolutely unacceptable.  If we want people to fall out of politics or look toward a third party, going down this road is how to do it. I do hope there is a clarification forthcoming.

Dean Barker :: Don't Go There
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Don't Go There | 24 comments
Icky (4.00 / 1)
I don't mind her bringing it up, but to then say, in effect, "So you should vote for me and be safe" is just nasty.



that was Dick Cheney's argument too.. (0.00 / 0)
Hillary really is a neocon her PR team is just good at marketing her "image",

much like coca cola.

"time to ask Americans to be patriotic about something other than war"- John Edwards


[ Parent ]
If this was a gaffe, that's two in one week (4.00 / 1)
First saying that our change of tactics is working in Iraq and insinuating that there was even some possibly that this unjust war could have been successful.

Now, reinforcing yet another Republican frame - that Democrats are weak on terror.  This is the politics of fear we are seeing.  It's almost as if she's holding another terrorist attack over our heads, under pain of more Republican electoral success should we not listen to her.

It's time we steer by the stars, and not the lights of every passing ship


On a scale of One to Macaca (4.00 / 3)
Where would you put this one, as far as gaffes go? Macaca being 10.

I'd have to give it a seven with a possible upgrade to almost Macaca depending on the coverage we see.


[ Parent ]
All the way up to Eleven! (0.00 / 0)
Y'think, the MSM will spin this all the way up to Macaca. HRC is having a baaaaaaaaaaaaaad day.

Eleven




SGS is Jack Mitchell of Lowell, MA. The symbolism of the "sleeping giant" is based on my HOPE for America.


[ Parent ]
"It's famous for its sustain" - n/t (0.00 / 0)


[ Parent ]
OK, let me see if I can explicate this. (4.00 / 1)
The plan to locate American military assets in the Indian Ocean/Persian Gulf region was hatched several decades ago.  It was why Saddam Hussein was being bribed in the '80s and then, when he wasn't accommodating, attacked in '91.  And still he didn't budge, despite the embargo, the no fly zone, the intrusive inspections, etc.  Bill Clinton obviously thought that his persuasive talents would ultimately prevail, but, in the mean-time, the Pentagon went ahead to plan an invasion and set up fourteen "enduring" bases.  By the time Bush Two arrived on the scene, patience had run out and some pretext for taking what was wanted (a foreign version of eminent domaine) had to be devised.
This was all known to the members of the various House and Senate committees which approved funding for the planning and ramping up the necessary transport and ancillary costs.  But, it was all a matter of national security and kept hush-hush.  Which was why, when Bush Two just mentioned John Kerry's votes, all Kerry could come back with was that the war had been mismanaged.
Holbrooke, one of the stars of the Bill Clinton administration, came out the other day and opined that Hillary would be less hesitant about doing what needed to be done.  The implication seems to be that Bill Clinton dallied and, if he'd done as he was advised, invading Iraq and getting rid of Saddam would have been a piece of cake.  You see, the planning for the invasion was top notch and went off without a hitch.  It was afterwards that Bush Two let everything fall apart.  (We're supposed to forget that the U.N. estimates that one million children died as a result of the embargo.  Or, if we remember, it was all Saddam Hussein's fault and the fact that the professional class of Iraqis, including doctors, were prevented from getting together with their peers and gather new life-saving information and medicines, is of no account).
A lot of mistakes were made during the Bill Clinton reign.  I do not think they should be swept under the rug by electing his spouse.

[ Parent ]
Except for places like Iraq, Darfur, Afghanistan and Somalia, (0.00 / 0)
people aren't in any more danger now than they were in the beginning of 2001.  Americans in particular.  Oh, there's just as many (about a hundred) of them being killed on a daily basis on our highways and many more hundreds maimed.  More people are suffering from asthma, diabetes, mercury poisoning, tuberculosis and, in cities like Boston, being shot dead by their neighbors, often accidentally.  There's more losing their homes and finding security under bridges and in dumpsters behind bankrupt shopping malls.  But, none of that's anything to be afraid of because it hasn't been orchestrated by non-English speaking people.

You know, I'm firmly convinced that dollars are just a symbol, a figment of the imagination.  On the other hand, people who are building bombs, designing missiles and putting together another weather-sensitive stealth fighter aren't available to design new energy saving technologies, teach our children advanced mathematic and physics or, sorry to mention it, reconstructing our bridges, crumbling sewer systems and water distribution lines.  Senator Dodd said the other day that the average age of our municipal water systems is 100 years.  (Of course, one explanation for that is the wholesale resettlement from the cities to the suburbs that's been encouraged for the last thirty years hasn't been provided with adequate water and waste-water systems, relying instead on pumping wastes into the ground).

I thought we were making good progress not talking about "god, guns and gays"--favorite Republican topics that they can't and don't intend to do anything about.  But now, all of a sudden, the political discourse is full of gossip about other people's peccadillos (rumored ethical lapses!) and monsters in caves.

Yes, it's pretty well known that New York has been lusting to become the Hollywood of the East.  But, is that any excuse for its politicians to generate horror fictions and pass them off as real?


Ka boom (4.00 / 1)
This is a big one. I think Dodd's comments struck the proper tone, but I can't wait to see the forthcoming statements from the rest of the group. Please keep us posted.

When I read this, I thought it was from the Onion. I was waiting for a punchline. This is not the sentiment that I want to see expressed in any Democratic candidate we put forward. The question is this: will it get enough play in the media to change minds out in the early states.

Any readers see this on the tube yet? Radio? Is there video from this event? Is it Macaca time in Concord?


Whistling past the graveyard. (4.00 / 4)
If the Senator believes that, in the event of another terrorist attack, voters will rush to elect the first woman President, she has far more trust in the maturity of the voting public than I do.

But wait: the whole point of her statement is that the American voter is dumb and easily swayed by irrational claims.

So it is simply a stupid, cynical, self-serving claim that doesn't even work.

Fire some people, Senator, before you say another word.


Spiral (0.00 / 0)
Downward, lately.

Sucks starting at the top!

SGS is Jack Mitchell of Lowell, MA. The symbolism of the "sleeping giant" is based on my HOPE for America.


[ Parent ]
Greed and Fear (0.00 / 0)
The Republicans took power by manipulating base instincts.
To believe as Elwood says, that "the American voter is dumb and easily swayed", you have to have experienced the same emotions. Hillary is neither or those two things, but
in her quest for the White House, and as First Lady she's shown a plastic ability to mold herself to deliver a message to different affinity groups in her camp.Heath Care Crusader becomes cookie baking floppy tie wifey. You remember her Southern drawl while preaching down South ? Yicky poo. She's a politician's politician, through and through.

If the sails and riggings on this ship are set by Captain Bill, who's behind all this Terror Talk, him ? They were down for a day or two in Chappaqua with 'no events scheduled' earlier this week.

Next time, there may be no next time.


[ Parent ]
Not exactly... (4.00 / 1)
what Elwood said.


SGS is Jack Mitchell of Lowell, MA. The symbolism of the "sleeping giant" is based on my HOPE for America.

[ Parent ]
Fire some people, Senator, before you say another word. (0.00 / 0)
may be impossible if its family

Next time, there may be no next time.

[ Parent ]
It's almost never the guilty (0.00 / 0)
who get fired. But the firing ceremony still purges some sins.

[ Parent ]
right (0.00 / 0)
from the company manual

search for the guilty
punish the innocent
reward the uninvolved

Next time, there may be no next time.


[ Parent ]
But......it's one of the three legs of her campaign. (0.00 / 0)
Here's a nice summary of her position.

As Richard Holbrooke explained over a year ago:


?She is probably more assertive and willing to use force than her husband,? says Richard Holbrooke, the former envoy for Bill Clinton. ?Hillary Clinton is a classic national-security Democrat. She is better at framing national-security issues for the current era than her husband was at a common point in his career.?

Holbrooke is the person about whom it is reported:


?In an unguarded moment just before the 2000 election, Richard Holbrooke opened a foreign policy speech with a fawning tribute to his host, Paul Wolfowitz, who was then the dean of the Johns Hopkins School of Advanced International Studies in Washington,? reported First of the Month following the terrorist attacks in 2001.

The article continued: ?Holbrooke, a senior adviser to Al Gore, was acutely aware that either he or Wolfowitz would be playing important roles in next administration. Looking perhaps to assure the world of the continuity of US foreign policy, he told his audience that Wolfowitz's ?recent activities illustrate something that's very important about American foreign policy in an election year, and that is the degree to which there are still common themes between the parties.? The example he chose to illustrate his point was East Timor, which was invaded and occupied in 1975 by Indonesia with US weapons - a security policy backed and partly shaped by Holbrooke and Wolfowitz. ?Paul and I,? he said, ?have been in frequent touch to make sure that we keep [East Timor] out of the presidential campaign, where it would do no good to American or Indonesian interests.?

In sum, Holbrooke has worked vigorously to keep his bloody campaign silent. The results of which appear to have paid off. In chilling words, Holbrooke describes the motivations behind support of Indonesia's genocidal actions:

?The situation in East Timor is one of the number of very important concerns of the United States in Indonesia. Indonesia, with a population of 150 million people, is the fifth largest nation in the world, is a moderate member of the Non-Aligned Movement, is an important oil producer -- which plays a moderate role within OPEC -- and occupies a strategic position astride the sea lanes between the Pacific and Indian Oceans... We highly value our cooperative relationship with Indonesia."

 


[ Parent ]
It is altogether possible (4.00 / 2)
that Senator Clinton will be our nominee.

It is also likely that she would be a vast improvement over the current occupant of 1600 Penn.

So why she would want to make her job of getting elected harder by depressing her own base with statements like this is beyond me (focusing, for the moment, on the strategic implications of the statement for the moment, and leaving aside the content, which, on its own, is worthy of censure).

birch, finch, beech


Counting chickens... (0.00 / 0)
Perhaps they see it as being not only possible but "inevitable" and are already posturing for the general election?  I mean, why the hell else would anyone say something like this in the 2008 Democratic primary after we've had 7 straight years of fear-mongering?

It's time we steer by the stars, and not the lights of every passing ship

[ Parent ]
she gives a rats ass about anyone (4.00 / 1)
more to the left of lieberman.

Lieberman's fundraiser has just joined her campaign.

Wait until the general when Hillary will give us her impression of General Patton in drag.

I'm not trying to be sexist but all the "commander in chief" B.S.  will make her going even more hawkish if she cons everyone with the media's help and gets the nomination.

"time to ask Americans to be patriotic about something other than war"- John Edwards


[ Parent ]
true (0.00 / 0)
stop me before I type again....

Next time, there may be no next time.

Are You Experienced? (4.00 / 2)
This is the biggest gaffe of the campaign thus far, IMHO.

During a recent "Daily Show" interview with Obama, Jon Stewart asked whether being First Lady was really a job qualification for being President. There is all this talk of "experience", but a statement like the one she made shows lack thereof as well as a lack of judgement.

Hillary was a lawyer, a politician's wife, with all that entails, and ran for Senator of New York. In fact, she moved to New York only for that purpose. She had never lived there before. She had connections and access through Bill. She didn't work her way up on her own.

At first I was prejudiced against her, then I decided to give her a chance, and after this I have to say she is my least favorite of the bunch. Using the specter of 9/11 in this way is going too far.


Daily Show was awesome (4.00 / 1)
Not only Barack's interview (nailed it) but almost as a prelude to this, Jon Stewart attempted to explain what foreign policy "experience" means, in a segment entitled America to the Rescue.

It's time we steer by the stars, and not the lights of every passing ship

[ Parent ]
Very popular on YouTube, it appears (4.00 / 2)


It's time we steer by the stars, and not the lights of every passing ship

[ Parent ]
Don't Go There | 24 comments

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